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 VVC Rally buildModerators: Jump to page : 1 2 Now viewing page 1 [25 messages per page] | |
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aquascrotum |
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 Regular Posts: 112  Location: Armagh, Northern Ireland | Hello all. Had previously posted in the Welcome and Technical sections that we're intending building a car for night navigation rallies, lanes rallies, maybe a bit of hillclimbing. I think the Lanes rallies are a bit of an Irish phenomenon, they're similar to Endurance rallies in GB (i.e. a blast on private lanes with some token measures to keep speeds down) but without the limitations in terms of car spec. In terms of what will drive the modifications to the car we need acceleration, traction and manoeuvrability as a good few Lanes rally special stages are more like autotests - so less focussed on the high speed cornering and stability the track day boys are looking for. We will also be fitting night navigation equipment (timing gear, lighting, map lights, tripmeter etc). The plan as it stands is to build the relevant tuny parts of an MGF VVC into a Rover 100 MPI. Meet Pinky (1997 143 VVC MGF in Barbie pink) and Perky (1997-ish 100 Kensington MPI).   When we got the 100 we were a bit apprehensive of gutting such a clean car. Then we lifted the carpets, started poking with the big screwdriver and now and have a couple of weeks of welding to do. At least our conscience is a little clearer though. The F is a ridiculously clean shell which will also be a shame to break. In terms of the immediate work to do / major questions: Does the VVC and PG1 box drop into the 100 front subframe or does it need the F rear subframe? How much modification is needed to the F subby if so? We'll be taking the F brakes - will these fit under standard 100 13" wheels? How big can we go before we need to start butchering arches, and what what is the best source of cheap steels (13s/14s) to match the 100 hub fitment? What exhaust manifold do we fit to the VVC when its in the 100? Intention is to get a full Talon exhaust system or similar so need something to tie into that. I understand the F steering geometry gives a quicker rack (great from our PoV) - but the F has a much worse turning circle. What is our best setup to give us a quicker rack, with ideally some negative camber, but without losing the 100 turning circle? Also - how does the power steering on the F rack affect installing into the 100? An finally for now - what is the best head gasket kit out there for the VVC? Edited by aquascrotum 28/5/2013 11:27 AM | ||
| GTaddz |
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 Expert Posts: 2568    Location: Up in the lakes | welcome mate, nice little 100 you got. best colour too  you can drop the engine and box into the metro subframe but will need to weld a bracket to the frame to mount the sump tie bar. i found it easier to get an angle grinder to the mgf subframe and chop off everything thats not needed. its pretty obvious what needs to come off once you have a look. dont forget the plate where the steering rack sits needs to be removed. the f brakes will fit under 13" wheels but you'l either need gti mpi alloys or wide steelies from an si. or use wheel spacers but if youre going vvc you'l want wide, sticky tyres. 14" wheels are about as big as you can go without arch modifications. i find 14" wheels spoil the handling even though 195/45/14 tyres have round about the same rolling radius as 185/55/13 tyres. use the exhaust manifold from the mgf, you'l need a gti mpi downpipe to match it to the rest of the system. im using mgf rack, tre's, bottom ball joints and steering arms set up with 30' toe out. great handling all round. i dont find the turning circle any worse than the std rack although there is 10mm less movement in an yellow / red band rack over the blue band rack. the power steering in an f doesnt affect installing the rack into a metro as its all in the column. and id use the payen bw750 elastomar gasket with payen head bolts. others preferre the mls though. hope this helps and good luck with the build. | ||
| aquascrotum |
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Regular Posts: 112 Location: Armagh, Northern Ireland | |||
| GTaddz |
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Expert Posts: 2568 Location: Up in the lakes | |||
| GTaddz |
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Expert Posts: 2568 Location: Up in the lakes | |||
| aquascrotum |
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Regular Posts: 112 Location: Armagh, Northern Ireland | |||
| aquascrotum |
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Regular Posts: 112 Location: Armagh, Northern Ireland | |||
| GTaddz |
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Expert Posts: 2568 Location: Up in the lakes | |||
| aquascrotum |
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Regular Posts: 112 Location: Armagh, Northern Ireland | Bit of an update. What was supposed to have been a couple of weekends patch welding the floor has turned into a 6 week every weekend + every weeknight that can be mustered under the car. She was rotten at both front jacking points, both skins under the section of double skin under the seats, front seat mounts, driver side door step, both rear quarters of the floor pan, back of the passenger side sill and on the hidden structural member that ties the subframe mount toward the door pillar...so we thought we were finished welding this weekend Floor finished (painted in various Rover/BL-heritage shades of blue)  ...and then took off the back bumper and had a detailed look in the boot   Car had been rear ended, the back panel is buckled, rear valance in absolute flitters, inner rear arch on the drivers side holed, and boot floor is holed through in about 6 places. The whole seam of the spare wheel well panel where it meets the rest of the boot floor is in sh*te. More worryingly the structural member carrying the loading from the rear cans into the floor is rotten through in a couple of places on both sides. So another week of welding awaits. In happier news we have a GTI spoiler and it looks like our TR7 rims will fit with spacers, and they give a nice squat stance. Hoping to get the main bodywork finished , then get the MG into the garage to start stripping parts. If anyone wants any of the F bits that we wont need for the VVC conversion let me know. TR7 Rims  | ||
| redgrave66 |
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 purple_metty Posts: 2165 Location: leicsestershire | oh the joys of restoring a metro, good to see work being carried out in the correct order | ||
| Paul r |
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| Extreme Veteran Posts: 539 Location: Swindon, Wilts | |||
| aquascrotum |
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Regular Posts: 112 Location: Armagh, Northern Ireland | |||
| deanflowers |
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| Regular Posts: 126 | |||
| Navrallymetro |
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| Member Posts: 71 | |||
| Navrallymetro |
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| Member Posts: 71 | |||
| aquascrotum |
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Regular Posts: 112 Location: Armagh, Northern Ireland | |||
| chris_evz |
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 aka chris_evz Posts: 2726 Location: brynna south wales | |||
| aquascrotum |
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Regular Posts: 112 Location: Armagh, Northern Ireland | Another brief update... Welding to the rear end panels was finished, we uncovered major holes round the structural members supporting the front of the rear sub frame so we'll tackle that when we have the rear subby out. We also helpfully had the d/s rear arch fall into our hands in the form of about a pound of filler when we took off the mid flap. Cue a first ever attempt at an arch repair.  Then we got a chance to get the MG in for stripping. We originally got the car for £250 (bargain we thought)...but the previous owner hadn't taxed it or SORNd it so it was clamped while sitting in storage. Cue £240 odd clamp release fees and another £140 odd of back tax (originally they wanted £400+!. So not such a bargain any more. Ironically if the Metty was in half as a good a shape as the MG was in terms of bodywork (no rust...anywhere) we'd have been flying.  Off to MG heaven.  It got what it deserved after the tax fiasco...  So at the minute we're re-building the MG subframe and will shortly be doing the engine head gasket and ancillaries, and thinking about the uprated oil rail. Also have to weld up the bottom of the VVC engine support that has rusted through (another nicely Rover-designed water trap). Then the metro comes in to get the engine and loom out to get it sent off for conversion...the plan is to finish the bodywork (including probably re-build of the other arch), modify the front end for cooling and taking an MGF rad etc, and get the new subframe installed in time for the loom to come back at which point its time for putting the engine in. We're coming up against a few queries at the minute...whats the preferred approach in terms of thermostats? As in are people using remote stats and/or using the newer Freelander PRT stats? Also really struggling to lay hands on anti roll bars. | ||
| aquascrotum |
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Regular Posts: 112 Location: Armagh, Northern Ireland | Thought I'd give more updating now that fun parts (rather than make-sure-the-car-doesnt-fall-apart parts) are starting to arrive. GTI arbs and all Ralphs tasty stainless clamps are en route, we'll be using the MGF anti roll bar clamp bushes for the time being. We got a number plate for the bonnet, which will allow us to open up the front bumper for cooling over a nice new MGF ally core radiator. Reconditioning of the TR7 alloys is ongoing - am not looking for a concours finish due to the amount of abuse they'll get, but I think they're looking pretty good all the same. Have also successfully trial fitted them over the GTI calipers and discs - had to grind off some of the caliper but there was lots of material and it's all weight saved.  Also have got some nice GAZ adjustable shocks, which means the dampers we salvaged from the MGF will go into storage as spares unless someone else wants them (look rough but operating well). Am hoping we've sourced a rear half cage, and in very exciting news we also got this....  If we had a decent exhaust system good to go I'm hopeful we'll be on the road for Christmas - theres a rally we've normall traditionally entered the day after Boxing Day which is our target shakedown day. | ||
| Ed Norton |
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 Veteran Posts: 310 Location: nr Evesham Worcs | Looking good and i am enjoying watching the progress.  Only thing you may find is overcooling from the mgf rad, as that is the set up i run in my car and as soon as i put my foot flat down the temp gauge drops to zero. | ||
| Navrallymetro |
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| Member Posts: 71 | |||
| aquascrotum |
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Regular Posts: 112 Location: Armagh, Northern Ireland | Ed Norton - 17/10/2013 12:46 PM Looking good and i am enjoying watching the progress. Only thing you may find is overcooling from the mgf rad, as that is the set up i run in my car and as soon as i put my foot flat down the temp gauge drops to zero.Thats interesting on the MGF rad. I think we need uprated cooling in some form - the sort of abuse the car will be getting is short sharp blasts of very high revs, stages are anything from say 0.5km to 5km but all slow in terms of top speed but very hard in terms of braking and short range low gear acceleration. Sustaining high revs or engine speeds over a long period (say that a race or track day car would be expected to be subjected to) shouldnt be an issue. We'd originally intended to open the front end up for cooling - I really don't want to make counterproductive changes and wind up thrashing a cold engine..? | ||
| Ed Norton |
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Veteran Posts: 310 Location: nr Evesham Worcs | |||
| Ed Norton |
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Veteran Posts: 310 Location: nr Evesham Worcs | |||
| aquascrotum |
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Regular Posts: 112 Location: Armagh, Northern Ireland | More progress... After the mess of the drivers side arch we took a closer look at the passenger side. The last owner seems to have attempted a half assed repair welding a new hoop onto rusty metal, or at best hasnt protected the weld, and then covered everything (the whole arch, front and back) with a good 8mm of isopon. Plan will be to tackle a decent repair when we get the rear sub out and do the rest of the boot floor at the same time.   And a good solid Saturday saw the MPI out and on the garage floor. Next steps are to recondition the VVC (HG etc) and finish off fishing brakelines and setting up the hydraulic clutch for the PG1 while we have access to the bulkhead, and look at the MGF rad and fabricate some spot lamp brackets on the front while we have manoeuvring room there too.  | ||
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